B&M vs. Intamin

Who is better and why??? Who makes the better rides???

Who is better and why??? Who makes the better rides???

Intamin rides tend to be faster and thrilling and record breakers for a short while, but B&M coasters tend to hold records longer and are more maintained.

For instance: I dont yhink Millennium force is the tallest anymore, but Apollo's still holds the record for most drops.

Both companies produce completely different styles of coasters. It just depends on the style desired. Intamin coasters have sharper turns and tend to be more rough, which appeals to some people. They also have tighter restraints and smaller cars, which can be a problem. B&M coasters are extremely smooth, and are more exciting than thrilling. The seats are large, and the restraints can be tiny and are moulded, which can also cause problems.

It really just depends on the space of the area, the height, the duration it will be open, and the demographic of the guests in the area. Personally, I prefer B&M because they are smoother and tend to be "bigger" (not necessarily in height or speed, but in excitement and quality) than Intamin.

B&M makes good, quality rides that don't break down three times a day. B&M rides are very smooth and continue to stay smooth. Apollos Chariot, Hulk, Alpengeist, Kumba, Riddler, Nemisis, Kraken are all in the top 10 roller coaster list and they are all made by B&M. Intamin has one coaster in the top ten and that is Millenium Force. So I say B&M is better.

Hmm, Millennium Force is the smoothest coaster ever and if you have been on it then you would know that it feels like you are gliding on air with no track below. B&M's track is way too big looking and not cool looking at all. They sit 4 people across which is so lame i laugh just thinkin about it. B&M couldnt hold a record if their life depended on it. There is no B&M coaster that i look forward to riding. By the way, TTD is the #2 coaster in the world, another intamin creation.....

Wait, I'm confused. If you already seem to know the answer why did you bother making this topic? Did you just want other people to respond so you could refute them? Seems like a waste of time, but whatever floats your boat.

TTD also hold the record for most breakdowns in a day...what is it...like 20?

Yet another record I'm sure Kingda Ka will eventually beat. These things take time.

TTD the 2nd best coaster in the world, I guess polls are always right so, That means the Hulk is still number one I saw that on the Discovery Channel, and isn't that a B & M.

Size and speed don't make the best rides to everyone. I have ridden TTD, 13 seconds wow, but I guess if going Up fast is your thing.

me and GOD thank you all for not being like the rest of the world. Me and God both know that you all have no idea what good stuff is, we know its all typical though.....

Oh, that explains it all.

(man, these discussion boards need a moderator)

If Ryan started the topic, its generally a good one to avoid. I always read for the fun of it.

I agree with Daniel, very comical. But B&M is the way to go. Besides, what's wrong with sitting 4 across. Most riders per hour means less wait time which means more people can enjoy the ride, in so facto more money for the park. (Awaiting hateful reply of how horrible a person I am for having said anything against the beloved Intamin by ryan)

I personally like Intamin AG rides better becuase they tend to be more thrilling. But Overall-B&M's dont breakdown as much. B&M originated from Intamin so they are very similar so its a tough call.

Ryan, I was judging from Themepark Insiders best roller coasters. Not what you thing is the best coasters. I know that MF is probably a smooth coaster but B&M rides are smooth as butter.

umm jake my boy, apollos is not that smooth, if u have been on it then u would know that it shakes wildly when goin up the hills. and its not that fast, i almost fell asleep on the ride, me and my boys tried 2 stand up on the ride just 2 get sum excitement out of it, thats not good now is it....

o and plus jake, the world voted MF and TTD as the top 2 coasters in the world, by the way CBS is airing a special on Cedar Point at 7 pm on friday night, cant wait...

Hooray! Trying to break park regulations is fun!

Apollo's Chariot was smooth as ice last time I was on her, but she hasn't got squat on SFOG's Goliath. I just wish we could have Goliath with the view that AC has...

Then again, there's about a gazillion factors that determine whether the ride is smooth or not. Last time I was on Kumba, I got beat up pretty bad, but I know that's not a normal ride. Even Hulk has an occasional off day.

Last time I rode Apollo's it appeared to be smooth! A great ride!

Yeah Ryan, I have no idea what you're talking about seeing as how Apollo's Chariot is the smoothest coaster I have ever ridden. I'm going to Cedar Point August 3rd and 4th so I'll let you know next week which is smoother.

Ryan, You are going to have a lot of speeding tickets when you get a licence if you think 72 MPH is slow. Have you ever rode an Intamin Stand-Up. OUCH!!!! But B&M stand ups are smooth as silk.

Actually Mantis, which is a B&M stand up, is pretty ruff on the head/ears. Yea Apollo's is pretty smooth goin down the hills and all but going up the hills it shakes, probably cuz the train is TOO big and ugly looking, too much weight for it not 2 shake and the design of the train causes it to be slower than Intamin Hypers. You ask 10 people which is better, Superman or Apollos and 9 of 10 will say Superman. Its always easy to tell which coasters are favorites just by looking at their wait times. MF's WEEKDAY lines are longer than Apollo's WEEKEND lines. That should tell you something right there!!!

Oh and I already have a drivers license, You might get 1 some day kid....

9 out of 10 prefer Superman over Apollos Chariot. Who are the 10 people because they have probably never rode the Chariot. Also I waited for about 10 minutes to ride Apollo on a Saturday one day. I would like to see a line on MF that is shorter than that. Headbanging does not count in a factor if a ride is rough. Next time you ride Mantis, keep you head pinned to the side and see if it is rough. B&M hypers are great for airtime. Intamins are good for speed and highlly banked turns. I like airtime better. Ryan, This is an opinion discussion. It is not a you have to say Intamin is better or Ryan will tell you your life is horrible.

The line was out of the station by a way but it went fast because the trains carry more people. Look at the lines at Raptor or Wicked Twister. Raptor goes quicker because it is four across. It would go faster even if they ran one train. When you go to Cedar Point do you just ride MF, TTD, and Wicked Twister since those are the only Intamin coasters with a 8 or higher rating.

Ryan at 7 on CBS friday....wheel of fortune is coming on looks nothing like a cedar point show to me.
My favorite coaster is an Intamin but I like B&M better. High capacity=fast lines. The trains are not ugly and four across is a smart move not a joke. Oh and go ahead and call me kid but judging by what youve been saying i think im more mature than you and im 14.

i'm not sure what time the show comes on friday, whenever the national news comes on. One of the guys from the news is taken a trip there with his dad. Dont u guys ever go on pointbuzz.com. Anyway, I will never understand what people find so good about B&M's. You will never ever see a 10 minute wait time 2 ride MF. Intamin trains are longer than B&M's if you didnt know so they almost hold the same amount of people.

Ryan CBS is doing nothing about Cedar Point. Chase is right. If someone is doing something on Cedar Point it will be the travel channel. Intamin trains and B&M trains are usually bigger than Intamins are anyway. Four across equals less cars and that equals less money to build.

That also equals more weight going pulling as the train flies up a hill and a faster drop afterwards due to the built up resistance. (like what makes Apollo's so full of air-time)

I dont really know which company is best as I dont really pay attention to what company makes which ride. I will say that most of the B&M coasters mentioned are usually very smooth, even over time. I think really its up to the designers of the coasters, not the makers to come up with new ideas and new elements....and for that matter the parks. They work with coasters and plans enough that they should be able to go to a manufacturer and say "do this this way, and make people go whooooooo."

Actually, the only thing Ryan has been right about in this whole forum is that CBS is indeed doing something this Friday on Cedar Point. It's a segment on the national news (check your local listings). They do some thing where viewers are presented with three stories, and they vote for the one they want to see. In this case, the story has to do with a reporter taking his dad to Cedar Point. It's not a situation where they're devoting a half hour to the park or anything - it'll be a 2 to 3 minute segment, unless the conflict in the middle east comes to a grining stop and there's no news in the world whatsoever.

You wouldnt see BGE on a news show unless its the local news. I cant wait until friday night. More publicity 4 the greatest park in the world. they should change their name 2 heaven, wonder if they would be allowed to. Aug 23 is the day that BGE is letting the world know what their new coaster will be.

Actually, BGW was mentioned on the Today show a few weeks ago. It was their budweiser grilled shrimp, but still it was on the national news.

Hey Ryan, I'm guessing that PointBuzz.com is a Cedar Point forum website. How about this, you stay there if you're going to keep bashing everyone that doesn't agree with you and call you god. Otherwise, I welcome you to participate in civilized discussion.

thats all i have done so far anyway, were all entitled to our own opinions, i have been to both parks multiple times so i know what im talkin about

Actually the Travel Channel did something on Busch a couple years back. They have also did a special on the Tampa Park. Why is this becoming a Busch Gardens vs. Cedar Point. I thought it was suppossed to be Intamin vs. B&M.

IF I was only allowed to ride one coaster for the rest of my life it would be an Intamin coaster, thats all folks....

RYAN WE GET THE POINT! YOU LOVE INTAMIN! Stop flaming the people who like B&M.

dont 4get 2 watch cbs 2moro nite, gonna b hot....

Yep, because CBS is the best network... I'm sure it'll be a 2 minute thing about how expensive and crowded it is and how all the rides have huge waits b/c they're open so few hours and open in may and close in september.

I'm sure the haterz in here will b watching...

Ryan, I think you should go ride Hulk, Kraken, Kumba, and Montu and tell me if you don't like B&M. Also ride the Dueling Dragons.

I don't get on coasters under 300 ft sorry!

To each his ( or her ) own.

Ryan, are you saying that you only ride 2 coasters?

Theres 4 coasters above 300 feet :D. Lol Ill bet Ryan has fun driving 12 hours to two of them. And getting on a plane to the SBNO one.

I'm just hoping that Kings Dominion gets a giga in the next year or 2 so that BGE can start biting their nails.....
I'm so glad that Cedar Fair bought them!

Busch will not be biting their nails because Griffon is going to be outstanding. It will be better than CP's coaster. Admit it Ryan, it will.

PKD getting a giga HAHA not gonna happen....well maybe I mean I would LOVE to have a giga 3 hours from my house. But that wouldnt scare BGE.

So...basically Ryan lives his life vicariously through 4 rides that together equal no more than 4 minutes of ride time...what a life.

lol Griffon will be some silly dive machine just like the one in tampa that no one but Busch fans talk about. I mean why build another coaster in the same park that will be very similar to Apollo's. Do you realize how many people in the USA are looking forward to CP's new coaster. They are allowed to go all out and dominate but BGE has to follow the rules of a neighborhood lmao. sux 2 b them i bet. 2007 is the year of the GIGA at PKD!!!

I get to close this disscusion with one thing. B&M makes better rides than Intamin. End of discussion.

Ok. here's your problem Ryan Saunders. You seem to me like the type of coaster nerd that doesn't know apples from oranges when it comes to the Amusement industry. You also seem to me to like the look of intamin rides and nothing more. I could care less how the ride LOOKS. Coasters are designed to give riders an experience that only a coaster can offer, to thrill them, to make them want to ride again. You can't ride the ride again if it won't work to run again. Intamin are drafters, and B&M are artists. Intamin has great ideas but can never execute them proprely, nor safely. B&M has a formula that they have found works, and though it may at times be too mellow (I wish they would make just one giga coaster) IT WORKS. Their rides are safe, fun, smooth comfortable, and make you want to ride again. They also have better capacity and easier maintenance, which parks like A LOT. Intamin makes great rides as well, and I LOVE their rocket coasters, but just look at TTD, KK, Xcelerator, and etc. They all have serious issues that take forever to work out. These issues should have been worked out at Intamin in the design phase of the process. This is especially evident with the recent Xcelerator accident which you can watch on youtube. That is unnaceptable. The bottom line is, B&M are much better engineers than Intamin, period. They have a better track record, and their rides haven't killed anyone yet as far as I know. And before you start talking bullsh*t about how the Intamin accidents on Superman: ROS and some other rides were ride op errors, let me tell you this. I don't give two sh*ts why it happened.. PEOPLE ARE DEAD. It's unacceptable to go to an amusement park, get on a ride (expecting to enjoy it), and end up dead. UNACCEPTABLE. And speaking of unacceptable, Maverick is the epitome of such failure. Intamin should be ashamed of themselves for that heartline fiasco that went down during construction. Their ride designers should have their degrees revoked. I can tell you, with no college education whatsoever, that the heartline was NOT gonna work just from looking at it. Many other people besides myself thought this too during construction. Another failure on behalf of intamin was their entire line of impulse coasters. I'm sure lots of enthusiasts looked at their spirals and said : NO WAY. Intamin tried to say: WAY, but before they could finish they had to add all that extra support to basically every impulse coaster including Wicked Twister. WTF??? You think that after the first one they'd beef up the structure on all of them, but NO, they built the twister without the extra support and ended up giving it crutches just to run. My point in all this is that these things DO NOT happen on B&M coasters. That's because B&M engineers their rides to a level of fun and safety that Intamin could only dream of. Intamin is far too concerned with breaking records to worry about making their rides rideable. That's why Maverick has a "70 mph" launch straight into a decceleration of about, what?, 20 mph. That's ridiculous. Honestly, I can say that the ONLY thing B&M does that I do not like is their block brakes. However, they are a necessary part of their safety system. So before you start whining about drag and resistance and etc., like you have a degree in engineering, remember that you know absolutely NOTHING. In which case, you're perfectly qualified to join the Intamin team. Have fun.

Anyone notice the comments about pkd receiving a giga?

Yeah I saw that too, "PKD getting a giga? Never gonna happen"

Highly ironic.

Things going for B&M
-Great, fun coasters, in my opinion not a sucky one out there
-very reliable
-high capacity (four seats is a great thing)
-sleek, very cool looking
-dont have to be the biggest to be the best
-very safe

Things going against Intamin
-very unreliable (ahem, TTD and Kingda Ka)
-not always a good ride, unles you were looking for a reason to need a deep massafge
-often low capacity
-not always safe
-I think some of the track is just bulky
-often the biggest but not the best

Point made!

Andrew, you can't do that without listing both sides. Your point is not made, here is my list of things going against B&M and for Intamin.

Things going against B&M:

1. The layouts are often repetitive.

2. They won't make bigger coasters or utilize the new technology like Intamin does.

3. Can get boring after riding them many times in a row.

4. Only have 6 types of coasters, and like I mentioned before layouts are repetitive so once you rode one of each type you pretty much rode them all.

Things going for Intamin:

1. Produce the most exciting and thrilling coasters.

2. Utilize the newest technology, which is probably why they aren't as reliable as B&M who doesn't utilize the technology Intamin does.

3. Almost all of the layouts of Intamins are different, so you hardly get the same ride at different parks.

4. They can make great huge coasters(Millennium, TTD, Kingda Ka) and can also make really great small coasters(Maverick)

1. Produce the most exciting and thrilling coasters.

Haha, Brandon, that's your opinion & not a fact about all Intamin coasters. But you definitely made very good points.

I beg to differ,
B&M has seven coasters-
-Sitting
-Floorless
-Standing
-Hyper
-Inverted
-Flying
-Diving

Plus, they never get boring, the layouts are great, and Intamin layouts can get boring, (ahem, new intimidator coaster)and often, the new technologies are a bust.

You can ALWAYS rely on B&M to provide a safe, trilling, and fun coaster that NEVER gets boring. I have ridden Kraken 25 times and am still not bored by it!

I have to second that. When I saw Intimidator 305's layout I was totally dissapointed, but, you never know, maybe it'll be a good ride. I just get tired of seeing the whole high pos. g. turn and overbank type thing worn out

GUYS, COME ON... just slow it down, instead of just yelling on line.

I'll make comments about your comments for both:

B&M are always super smooth, and rarely get rougher over the years (with an acception of the hulk). Intamins, however, do get rougher over the years, but it usually isn't too bad. Even when intamin coasters come out, they aren't super smooth like B&M, but it makes their coasters more intense. Oh, and for B&M, the smoothness can make the ride more or less enjoyable. Sometimes you want your ride a little "aggressive", which B&M coasters can't do as well as Intamin.

Okay, all coasters for both companies aren't too repetitive. I have ridden a Batman the ride clone 13 times in a row. But for Intamin, I've ridden S:ROS at my home park, SFA, over 125 times in my life, and my record for the day is 23. (That ride never gets old! :D)

Although B&M only has 7 types of coasters, they are all amazing. Also, even though they are never over 250 feet, they are rarely below about 120, besides the batman clones. They are always lengthy, too! Intamin, on the other hand, make a huge variety of coasters. LIM, LSM, inverted, sit down, hyper, giga, strata, cable lift, woodie, impulse, etc., plus some flat rides. They can be as high as 456 feet and as fast as 128, but they can also be pretty short. They can be really long, but some of them are pretty short.

I love B&M's seating: 4 across, and always at least 7 rows. Besides Cedar Fair and Hershey, they let you ride again in an open seat, so you don't have to go around. That way, you can ride the same ride over and over! On intamin, it's almost always 2 across. the trains can be from 3 cars to 9!

So, both companies have their ups and downs. They are both my 2 favorite designers, and I can't choose which is better. As for my top ten list, this is how I place them:

1. Kingda Ka
2. El Toro
3. Griffon
4. Volcano: The Blast Coaster/ Goliath (SFOG)
5. Alpengeist/ Apollo's Chariot
6. Stormrunner
7. Nitro
8. Hydra: the Revenge
9. Lightning racer/ Dominator
10. The Boss/ Talon

1: Intamin
2. Intamin
3. B&M
4. Intamin/B&M
5. B&M/B&M
6. Intamin
7. B&M
8. B&M
9. GCI (my fav woodie only company)/B&M
10. CCI/B&M

Take some time and go through your top 10 and see which is better for you! Mine is split practiacally right down the middle! :D

My Top 10
1)Sheikra
2)Goliath
3)Hulk
4)Expedition Everest
5)Rock 'n' Roller Coaster
6)Montu
7)Superman/Bizaro (SFNE)
8)Kumba
9)Scorpion
10)Great American Scream Machine (SFOG)

I know its a weird list, but my interests are a bit different. I am not always for the biggest and the best!

Manufacturers
1)B&M
2)B&M
3)B&M
4)Vekoma
5)Vekoma
6)B&M
7)Intamin
8)B&M
9)Schwarzkopf
10)Philidelphia Toboggan Company

My Top ten list has spoken out about my interests!

I'm guessing you like Bizarro more than that, because you just want to prove your point, but I'm probably wrong. ;)

It's not too weird, but all I wanna know is which parks have you been to? Because you didn't put the best coasters toward the end... in my opinion, of course. And yes, GOLIATH IS AWESOME! :D I love the front!

And please go to my discussion of Top 10 coasters and post your top 10! thanks! :D

Eli, Cedar Fair [well, Cedar Point] will often let you reride if there's no one waiting to board on a slow day. On one of our trips over the past couple months, my friends and I rode Magnum a good 10 or so times before we had to give up our seats.

And I'm sick of people saying either Intimidator layout is "boring". Sure, it may not appear to be a thrilling layout but neither has given any rides yet so who are we to judge?

First off, I believe it looks boring, not is. Of course I cannot pass judgement until I actually ride it.

And no, Eli, I don't like Bizzaro more. I like the first drop, but after that I kinda feel it is a little lackluster. I am probably alone when I say that. And to answer your question, I grew up around the Orlando parks and they are still my favorites. I will admit that it is a completely biased list, but isnt it supposed to be?:)

Top 10:
1)Apollo's Chariot (BGE)
2)Volcano: The Blast Coaster (KD)
3)SheiKra (BGA)/Griffon (BGE)
4)Diamondback (KI)
5)Hulk (IOA)
6)Kraken (SWO)
7)Superman (SFFT)
8)Kumba (BGA)
9)Montu (BGA)
10)Dueling Dragons (IOA)

1)B&M
2)Intamin
3)B&M/B&M
4)B&M
5)B&M
6)B&M
7)B&M
8)B&M
9)B&M
10)B&M

I guess I really like B&Ms. Wow, I never realized that it was that high. With the exception of Volcano, I could probably be classified as a B&M freak.

Also, I am personally looking forward to Intimidator 305. The high speed curves look to be fun as opposed to boring. Also, the banked S-Bend turns look like loads of fun. I can't wait to ride it.

Now the other Intimidator made by B&M looks like a lot of fun to me!

Here is my Top 10, but please understand I have only been to Lagoon, Disneyland, Disney's California Adventure, Magic Kingdom, EPCOT, Disney's Hollywood Studios, Animal Kingdom, Knott's Berry Farm, Universal Studios Hollywood, and Six Flags Magic Mountain.

1.X2
2.Tatsu
3.Expedition Everest
4.Terminator Salvation
5.Xcelerator
6.Silver Bullet
7.Riddler's Revenge
8.California Screamin'
9.Scream!
10.Wicked!

1. S&S
2. B&M
3. Vekoma
4. GCI
5. Intamin
6. B&M
7. B&M
8. Intamin
9. B&M
10.Zierer

I think I305 looks really awesome, but could have more airtime. I see where you're coming from, Andrew, but from my view, I can't wait to ride it, and I expect it to be AT LEAST in my top ...15 or so (not that I have that). This will also be my first giga, if you don't count Kingda Ka. Well, this will be my tallest lift hill!

Alright, now on responses:

Andrew, I'm just saying that most of your list is from Florida. I've only been on the east coast besides St. Louis. I just thought that maybe you haven't tried other Intamins, but maybe you have.

Haha wow Adam! Yes, Volcano deserves its spot!

intamin... they make superman:ride of steel. nuff said

I live in Virginia. The best coaster here is Apollo's Chariot @ BGE. It's a B&M hyper (which is B&M's best type). I love B&M hypers. HOWEVER, something is coming that will eclipse AC and all of her clones. Intimidator 305 will take the roller coaster to a new plateau. State-of-the-art is being redefined. Please check this link...
http://yfrog.com/05coasterssidebysidej
You can see four great B&M's and two Intamins, side-by-side. Clearly, the B&M's with their superior capacity and the best lap-restraint in the business are better than the Superman Ride at SFA, which represents the "old Intamin" of 10+ years ago. (NOTE: I haven't ridden Top Thrill Dragster or Kingda Ka, and they certainly represent a unique form for Intamin that can't be ignored.) BUT... as a next-generation gravity coaster with a 300' drop, 93+ MPH, 85 degrees (basically straight down) and the most awesome coaster structure on the planet, I-305 ushers in a whole new level of thrill. I think Intamin is about to take a commanding lead (if it in fact trails B&M). I cannot wait to get to Kings Dominion in 2010!!!

See I just don't get why I-305 is so great... Just one head crushing g-force turn after another... High G's is my least favorite part about roller coasters, I'm a sucker for airtime I suppose.

It'll have no greater speed/height then Millennium Force, why is it so groundbreaking?

If you want to know, look into it. There is a website. I-305 will have plenty of airtime. As I stated before, AC is my favortie coaster. BUT, there are a whole MESS fo B&M hypers and they are all virtually identical. So, if you just like good airtime rides, you are in luck - there are several. However, If you want to fly straight down face-first at 93+ (now THAT is REAL airtime!) and STILL get a lot of airtime humps and incredible ground-level speed as well, I-305 is for you. If not, that's ok - one less person in front of me in line! (Did you check out the link?) BTW - "Head crushing"? Have you bothered to look at the revolutionary track? The incredible forces will be applied plenty smoothly. I am really beginning to think folks just don't have a grasp on this - 93+ 85 degrees... Have you ridden MF? It's great! 305 will simply take the GIGA coaster up a notch. Now there will be TWO in the Western Hemisphere! But, if you just like hyper-humpers, that's cool - as of right now, they are my favorites, too. As of 2010, we'll see. But, "something new and unique" has GOT to be better than "yet another one" IMHO. ;0)

"Head Crushing" Yes I have seen the new track, I believe it's only designed to take the sheer force from the train running by, not to reduce G's.

You keep coming back to 93mph and an 85 degree drop, yes it's intense but it's nothing different then what we've already seen...

Whenever I ride Mamba at Worlds of Fun my least favorite part is the helix, so I just have something against strong g forces.

Interesting that the person who made that cute little graph chose to leave off Millennium Force. While the five degree difference in the initial drop angle is notable, I fail to see how it represents any sort of technological advancement.

But this is all academic. A line graph isn't going to help me figure out if a ride is fun or not. We'll just have to wait until the thing opens (considering Intamin's track record, I'm calling it for mid-June) and find out for ourselves.

Not necessarily, Steve. I would have to say that intamin has mastered the cable lift. Yes, I know that april is way off, but I'm confident they will open it before it gets late in may.

I wonder if folks that have a less-than-stellar opinion of I-305 have been to Cedar Point, recently. MF is a Top 10 coaster in the world. Maverick is one of the most exciting new coasters. I-305 will combine the best of both of those and take it to a higher level with the steeper drop, more air-time, and an incredible state-of-the-art structure. My suspicion is that they just don't "get it". They have never experienced MF. Perhaps they haven't ridden a ride that travels over 70-75 MPH. Perhaps they feel threatened, in some way. Maybe they are just SCARED!!! But, I hope they will come to KD and ride it. If, after riding I-305, they are still unimpressed (which is unlikely), so be it. They can head on over to any of several parks that present lesser rides and find contentment in mediocre clones and 1990's technology!

Wow, Peter. You're going for the "if you don't agree with me, you must not have been to ____ and ridden ___" argument? Grasping at straws much? I've been to Cedar Point (great park filled with mediocre rides). I've no idea how that's supposed to help me judge a ride that isn't open yet. But feel free to keep on keeping on judging everyone else's opinion. You're getting dangerously close to sounding like a better-spoken Ryan...

What is your motivation? Why turn a discussion into something personal? By saying CP has mediocre rides, you have given us a strong basis for judging your level of expertise!

Hey, hey now. Lets all just calm down and be civilized here. Of course no one can pass final judgement on I-305 until it opens, some just like to speculate. Also, this is a website for opinions so he can say that the rides at Cedar point are mediocre. Different people like different kinds of different coasters, and criticizing someone's beliefs is just a little unfair.

Oh, and B&M is still better:)

You're right andrew - for some reason this steve lee person took something very personally and decided to attack rather than discuss. He just seems to want to put down I-305 and Cedar Point rather than tell us why he likes his favorites better. I don't get it.

Peter, re-read the post DIRECTLY before mine. If you can't figure out why it might be met with animosity, maybe this internet thing isn't for you.

And I absolutely stand by my opinion that Cedar Point is a great park with mediocre rides. Beautiful location, but I feel that Cedar Fair has been into the "let's see what records we can break this year" game for far too long (which is why I was pleasantly surprised by Maverick - in theory, at least. Riding Maverick wasn't nearly as fun as looking at it for me. I was pretty rattled by the whole affair).

So yeah, not a fan of Maverick. Top Thrill Dragster? Great 17 seconds. Not something I'd want to stand in line for any great period of time for unless it was the first or second train of the day and there was a chance of getting a rollback (I was one train too late last time). Millennium Force has been down two of the three times I've been there, and I wasn't waiting an hour on the third occasion. I'll try to pick it up next season, but I'm not going to go drown myself in Lake Erie if I miss out. Raptor? Tied with Alpengeist as my least favorite B&M inverts. Mantis? Balls. Magnum? Great from a historical perspective, but that is one rattly SOB. I respect Wildcat for being a Schwarzkopf, but it's still a carnival ride. Iron Dragon is bettered by both Top Gun/Flight Deck and the Big Bad Wolf (RIP). Corkscrew is a fairly basic Arrow. Quantity just ain't equaling quality here, folks.

The coasters I genuinely liked at Cedar Point were 1. Gemini, 2. Blue Streak, 3. Mean Streak (yeah, I know) 4. Disaster Transport (bobsled coasters RULE!) and 5. Wicked Twister (but I had been at Geauga Lake getting multiple re-rides on Steel Venom the day before, so it wasn't that big a deal). Note that two of those are wooden coasters, and there's two better wooden coasters elsewhere in the state (Beast and the SBNO Big Dipper over at Geauga Lake).

As far as their flats go, I live in a city that holds a state fair. I don't need to partake in yet another Matterhorn, Octopus, Troika, or Calypso or Scrambler. The only flats that are really notable are Chaos (due to its relative rarity nowadays), MaxAir (too short a program to really be fun), and Skyhawk (WAY too short a program to really be fun).

So five coasters I give a rip about (six if you want to count Gemini twice, which is appropriate) and a few flats that are above average. This is what the fanboys are worked up over? This is the holy grail of the amusement industry?

Nope. Not buying it.

So there's my opinion of Cedar Point. If anything, Cedar Point should make me like Intamins more than B&M, since I loathe both B&Ms in the park...

And I still have no reference to know if I-305 is going to be any good. Just like everyone else, no matter how many line graphs you show.

Yeah, Steve, over the past month or so (after SFGAdv), I'm starting to think that CP isn't all that as I used to think. Don't get me wrong, it would be a blessing, it's just not as "astonishing" as I used to imagine. Now, I would actually rather go to SFMM.

On CP for me:
Blue streak looks like a classy woodie, but not worth a 10 hour drive from here or a 4 hour drive from my friend in Cinci's.
Cedar Creek mine ride... no need to be talked about
Corkscrew just looks like an old standard, beat up arrow looping coaster
For disaster transport: I have ridden a bobsled, but not an Intamin, so I expect it to be fun
Gemini looks fun, especially with the reviews
Iron Dragon would be my first arrow suspended, but I'm not too excited
Magnum... yeah I've ridden enough hypers, thanks.
As I've heard from others, Mantis is too rough to touch, but I thought Georgia Scorcher was fun with proper foot position.
Maverick looks awesome, and I've heard mixed reviews. Still, I've ridden a variety of different coasters that would be mushed together to make this guy
Donno if I should try Mean Streak
Mullenium force... I used to always try the front for the speed, but I've gotten my top speed I'll get for a while with Kingda ka, but I'm still looking forward to this!
I've ridden plenty of B&M inverts, so I'm sure Raptor will just be another
TTD: as I said, Kingda Ka just without shoulder restraints. Cool twist, but I've technically ridden it. I would still love to give it a shot, but I can experience the same pretty much at SFGAdv.
Wicked twister, I've gotten a strait spike at dorney.

Oh, steve, if raptor and Alpie didn't do too much for ya, what did in the B&M inverts section? Alpie is my favorite, and the batman clones, although awesome, are my least

Oh, and anyone is free to rip at my selections for CP. Shoot.

One last thing: Ever since I was on this site, Steve has been here. As I've learned about him, he's only being "unpleasant" because you are, Peter. Be aware of that.

Eli, your CP choices suck.

Kidding, although I don't want my opinion to taint yours. Lots of people love the hell out of Cedar Point. I just think it's a case where they often set records at the expense of creating lasting quality rides. Reading what you said, I have to at least defend Disaster Transport for being indoors and add that (even with the rickets), Magnum can be a fun ride. Sometimes the painful ones are fun - you wouldn't believe how much fun we had getting the crap beaten out of us on Thunderhawk at Worlds of Fun. Magnum is nothing like a B&M hyper, and the tunnels really make for an enhanced ride experience (why the hell isn't anyone building B&M hypers with tunnels?!?!)

For me, Alpengeist's biggest problem is pacing. Because they wanted to make Alpengeist so big, the individual elements are spread out too far. There's a natural progression on the better B&M inverts that just isn't there (I do like the last run through the trench, however. Too many coasters don't have strong finishes, blowing through all the good stuff before the MCBR). It's also gotten pretty rattly lately - when I rode it last month I was very eager to get off as quickly as possible.

Raptor has similar pacing issues - they had to build the coaster around what was already there, so there's some unusual choices in direction and element placement. Again, the natural progression isn't there. It's hard to describe what I mean with "natural progression," but I guess it comes down to a very personal opinion. It was a walk-on when I rode it, and there was zero interest in turning around and giving it another go.

The B&M inverts that have really rocked out are (pretty much in order) Montu, Top Gun/Afterburn, Patriot, Dueling Dragons' Fire, and the Batman clones. But those are all pretty well universally loved coasters so it's not like I'm really trying to be the cool kid who wants to be different with those picks. Okay, some folks would argue that Fire wouldn't be worth talking about if it wasn't part of Dueling Dragons. I agree with that - if you put Fire at a Six Flags in a parking lot it would be incredibly underwhelming. But within the package ride of Dueling Dragons, it freaking delivers the goods.

And the Batman clones represent a case of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." The two I've ridden have been very tight and very fast. Jeez, I think I may have greyed out on SFOG's Batman last time I rode it (wet track FTW). The only other coaster that ever managed to do that was Voyage (before they added the ridiculous and relatively pointless trim on the return section - and again the track was wet).

(oh, and thanks for the support)

Although Alpie's finish is short (heartline, flat spin, helix), I think it's actually one of the best parts of the ride.

The ending portion of Alpie is THE best part of the ride.

Wow, this thread is very funny. Such venom. And to think it all started back in 2006.

Okay, I like lists, so here is mine:

1) Kraken (B&M) - Smooth as silk, and all those inversions. Amazing.

2) Apollo’s Chariot (B&M) - Airtime machine.

3) The Voyage (Gravity Group) - Best wooden coaster, EVER.

4) Revenge of the Mummy (Premier Rides) - USF's winner is the best themed coaster since the Yeti broke down.

5) Expedition Everest (Vekoma's apology for the Boomerang) - Fix the Yeti, Disney, and this coaster goes back to #1.

6) Incredible Hulk Coaster (B&M) – It’s all about the first 15 seconds of the ride. Wow!

7) Griffon (B&M) – Fast, smooth, and unique (for now) to BG parks, at least in the United States.

8) Powderkeg (Premier Rides originally and S&S Power later) – Great launch, fantastic scenery, low 42” height requirement. Best family coaster of all time.

9) Alpengeist (B&M) – Best invert I have ridden.

10) Prowler (GCI) – Smooth as silk, fast as lightning, it hugs the terrain and turns on a dime. Brilliant night ride, as well.

For the record, I have not yet ridden Manta, Diamondback, Maverick, Bizzaro, or any of the coasters at SF Great Adventure. However, of those coaster I have ridden (and there are many), I guess I would say I am a B&M guy.

Hee hee hee ... that sounds funny to me ... hee hee hee ... a B&M Guy ... hee hee hee ...

Whoa whoa whoa james. You can't claim the gravity group with the best woodies. Now try an intamin pre-frab! :D

No wooden coaster beats the Voyage. It is #1. Even your beloved Amusement Today Golden Ticket Awards recognize that fact. Heck, the Voyage may even be the best coaster overall, but I refuse to take that title from a steel masterpiece like Kraken, for some strange reason.

... again, I beg the question: have you ridden an intamin pre-frab?

No, I have not ridden El Toro, Eli. I am sure I would love it, and I am sure it could be as good as the Voyage, but not better. I refuse to accept that possibility.

Quid pro quo, Eli, have you ridden the Voyage?

Yes, I know I haven't ridden it... I really want to though!!! Sadly, I don't think I'll be in Indiana anytime soon... If and when I go, i'll be sure to hit there and Indiana beach!

So, you've got your El Toro and I have my Voyage, and never the twain shall meet.

We must agree to disagree, Eli, until such a time as one of us can experience both uber coasters.

yup. Just if you ever go to NY... be sure to go in the summer ;)

http://picasaweb.google.com/worldwidebrian/Intimidator305Construction112009#5406287186925951010

Take a look ^^^ If this Intamin doesn't excite you, you are missing the coaster gene! Yes, my favorites are B&M, but this is unlike any Intamin before!

I am a B&M fan and i also like Intamins. Not all Intamins or all B&Ms are great. I know Mantis and Chang, they are rough. Shockwave and Cobra (La Ronde) so are some Intamin Rockies that can be thrilling yet shaky and uncomfortable like TTD or Xcelerator. B&Ms are very careful of their coasters and very reliable. Intamins are thrilling yet don't do the same layouts on the same coasters, but caused some deaths and breakdowns much. I love B&M's airtime and smooothness. I would say Intamins can be as smooth depending on the track. Intamin's triangular is smooth like butter so is B&M's Hypers. By the way, smoothness makes the ride feel more comfortable. Here are my Top 10 Coasters.

1. Goliath (Smoothness and Airtime)
2. Maverick (Very filling Lift Hill, I like the Horseshoe and the tunnel lauch.)
3. Griffon (Fast, big and smooth as wonder.)
4. Diamondback (Airtime, smoothness and water involving. I like the scenery.)
5. El Toro (Smooth as steel, good airtime)
6. Apollo's Chariot (Smoothest Coaster i've been on).
7. Dominator (Have you ridden it? It's a thrilling machine.)
8. Superman Ride of Steel (Smooth yet unstoppable fun and speed despite not much airtime hills.)
9. Georgia Scorcher (Not like Mantis or Chang, short buy comfortable to ride on.)
10. Prowler (Better than any traditional woodie you have been on, silky and fast.)

1. B&M
2. Intamin
3. B&M
4. B&M
5. Intamin
6. B&M
7. B&M
8. Intamin
9. B&M
10. GCI

Welcome to TPI, Eugene! I love goliath too :D But, I think only the front has the amazing amount of airtime. I was really expecting the back to have way more, but still, front with the speed and everything... amazing... anyway, I like your choices... but I think dominator wasn't THAT good at KD. And which Superman? Like which park? SFNE or SFA? (I'm from MD, so I love SFA :D)

Superman Ride of Steel in SFA. Darien Lake removed its front name and SFNE changed and rethemed to Bizzaro. Why do you don't like Dominator? Have you ridden it? BTW if u can't see my name im actually Eugene.

Im wondering why Bizzaro (formerly Superman Ride of Steel) had to add extra support on the lift hill. :S
Eli have you been to Cedar Point? Here is my top 10 list of the coasters there:

1. Maverick (Like no other Intamin i've ridden before)
2. Magnum XL-200 (I've ridden alot of hypers, this was also good)
3. Top Thrill Dragster (I've never been on Kingda Ka but i liked it. Good views of the whole park)
4. Millenium Force (Smooth and very fast, tunnels are also good)
5. Gemini (It's a steel version of Coney Island Cyclone)
6. Disaster Transport (Best Bobsled! It was a good idea making it indoors!)
7. Raptor (I've been on alot of B&M inverts, this one was pleasant)
8. Wicked Twister (I've ridden V2 and Possesed, first half was good, then it gets a bit boring)
9. Cockscrew (It looks fun, but it was OK)
10. Mean Streak (Also looks fun, but OUCH! Never ride a Dinn woodie!)

9. Cockscrew (It looks fun, but it was OK)
____

Was that unintentional... Or is it really that bad? XD
Anyways, who's going to K.O this thread?

"SFOG Goliath", why don't you want us using your real name? And I forgot about the bizarro change... anyway, Dominator was fun, but I didn't get to ride the front, so I feel like I didn't experience it all... is it better in the front? My friend REALLY didn't want to ride it there :( long story. James, if you're reading this, can you try to find my tr from '09 to KD? I couldn't find it!

Oh i just realized! 100!

Tweet

Vacation deals

• Walt Disney World
• Disney Cruise Line
• Adventures by Disney
• Universal Orlando

Park tickets

• Disneyland Resort
• Tokyo Disney Resort
• Hong Kong Disneyland
• Disneyland Paris

• Universal Studios Hollywood
• Universal Orlando Resort
• Universal Studios Japan

Subscribe by email

Subscribe by RSS

New attraction reviews

• 2025, 2024, 2023, 2022, 2021, 2020
• 2019, 2018, 2017, 2016, 2015, 2014, 2013, 2012, 2011, 2010
• 2009, 2008

News archive

• 2025, 2024, 2023, 2022, 2021, 2020
• 2019, 2018, 2017, 2016, 2015, 2014, 2013, 2012 , 2011, 2010
• 2009, 2008, 2007, 2006, 2005 (12/27-31), 2005 (1/1-12/26), 2004

© Theme Park Insider^®   About · Rules · Privacy · Contact