The Walt Disney Company is just weeks away from launching its sixth cruise ship, as it kicks off a 12-month expansion that will see the Disney Cruise Line add its seventh and eighth ships, as well.
That's quite the turnaround from four years ago, when the pandemic led many to write off the cruise industry. How has Disney managed this turnaround and positioned itself for its cruise business to expand - to a total of 13 ships within the decade?
Earlier this week, Disney invited me to talk one-on-one with Thomas Mazloum, the President of Disney's New Experiences Portfolio & Disney Signature Experiences. As such, Thomas leads the Disney Cruise Line, Disney Vacation Club, Adventures by Disney, National Geographic Expeditions, Golden Oak, Aulani, Disney Institute, and Storyliving by Disney.
In our interview, Thomas talked about the three new ships coming in the next 12 months - Disney Treasure, Disney Destiny, and Disney Adventure - and shared some potential good news for Disneyland fans who have been waiting for more Disney Cruise options out of Southern California. Here is an edited transcript of our conversation.
Robert: I want to start with Josh D'Amaro's announcement at D23 about adding four more new ships. When Josh made that announcement, I could not help but think back to March 2020, when so many people thought that the cruise industry might be finished. What, specifically, have you and your team done over the past four years not just to recover from the pandemic but to position Disney for this expansion?
Thomas: Robert, you know, that really is a great question. The pandemic was challenging for everyone, including crews. But having said that, as we've seen around the globe, people are really starting to focus on the experience economy. I think the experiences were already important pre-Covid, but I would argue that they're even more important today, and especially for families that want to come together at the same time.
We are in a period of unprecedented growth. I often say it's three vacations in one: you get your great Disney vacation, the comfort of a cruise, and great destinations. You then add to that the fact that Disney Cruise Line, even pre-Covid with only four ships, has always been a great ambassador for the Disney brand. So now this growing fleet allows us to bring that Disney vacation magic to new audiences.
We have more options for domestic audiences as well as for the fans all around the world, so you put that together. I gotta tell you, Robert, what we're seeing is great. Thankfully, the demand for Disney Cruise is very strong. We offer a premium brand within the cruise sector and the occupancy, and frankly, the business is performing very well. The cruise line truly brings together some of the very best of what the Disney Experiences segment has to offer, which is really great storytelling, innovation, and great service.
Robert: With all these new ships coming in, is the priority here, expanding service in Florida or adding more home ports around the world?
Thomas: Well, I think we're going to do a little bit of both. Next year, we're launching two ships, and I think they are maybe a few weeks apart. One will be here in Florida, in our new terminal down in Fort Lauderdale - the Disney Destiny. The other one will be on the other side of the world, in Singapore, serving predominantly the Southeast Asian market from India down to Indonesia. [That's the Disney Adventure - Robert]
Let me go back one step and just put it in perspective for you. Before we took on Treasure, I think we were 5% of the Caribbean market and 2.5% of the global market. So we believe there's plenty of room for us to do both, to provide more options for our domestic audience, because we are far from being penetrated there, and to use that asset - which is a movable asset, right, a cruise - and serve some of our fans around the world that don't always have an easy access to a theme park to get their Disney Experience.
The cruise industry is scheduled to grow, I think it's 20% in the next two years, right, by 2027, we're up to 40 million? So there is, call it classical industry growth. But what I always keep emphasizing to people is, on top of the industry growth, there's the Disney growth. And what I mean by that is more than 40% of the people who come for the first time on a Disney cruise have told us, in no uncertain terms, that the only reason they consider this type of vacation is because we as a brand are operating in that space. So you now take these three things together. You have the industry growth. You have the Disney phenomenon of people saying, I took it just because of you. And you now say to yourself, oh, wait a second, we're still small on the domestic market, and we have the whole world out there to serve. Put all of that together, and it makes it really does create, in my view, the perfect time to expand Disney Cruise Line, and that's exactly how we intend to operate.
Robert: You mentioned Disney adventure, and I think that story is just fascinating. Could you tell us a little bit about how Disney got that opportunity, and why you chose to bring that ship specifically to Singapore?
Thomas: It was one of our business partners that brought us this opportunity. [That partner is the Meyer Werft shipbuilding company, which built Disney's Wish-class ships as well as the abandoned Global Dream that Disney took over and completed as the Disney Adventure - Robert] We've never done that before. You know, we took a look at it and realized that there were certain elements that really lend themselves to an experience that we could do in an effective way. And of course, we've been looking at opportunities globally as well as domestically. We have beautiful theme parks in Tokyo all the way down to Hong Kong and China. There is now an opportunity to take this asset and move it to an exciting place like Singapore, which I think is one of the most exciting cities in the world, to be honest, just my personal view, I love it.
At the same time, then we can serve an entire audience in these emerging economies - you think about India, Malaysia, Thailand, Philippines, and so forth, right? So it's an effective way of using that asset and enter that market. So it was really an opportunity, a wonderful opportunity, and so far the feedback that we've seen is tremendous from that part of the world, just like it is for this part of the world, where we're still so small.
Robert: I wanted to talk about another market - one that's very close to me, being in Southern California. What's it going to take with this cruise expansion to get more Disney cruises coming out of Southern California? Because I can't believe it's lack of demand.
Thomas: Yeah. Listen, Robert, I gotta tell you, there's no question we love the West Coast, because we love Disneyland. We love the fans there. We've already operated seasonally in Alaska in the summer. We've operated cruises seasonally out of San Diego, which we love. Naturally, the expansion enables us, as I've mentioned before, it enables us to serve more people here, domestically, as well as around the globe.
While we haven't made any firm commitments, as you can imagine, previously, we were limited with the size of our fleet and where we best utilize that. Disney Cruise Line initially started here in Florida, in combination with Walt Disney World. So naturally, the West Coast is, no doubt, one of our priorities as well, in the future. So without me making an official announcement here - I think you will understand that - I think there's a lot to look forward to both on both coasts, including the West Coast.
Robert: I'm very much looking forward to that. And you know where to get hold of me when you're ready to make that announcement. I want to circle back with something that you referred to a little bit earlier. And I want to start with just an admission that I'm not really that much of a cruise fan, except for Disney cruises. Tell me about how you've translated a Disney experience to a cruise vacation to make it appealing for more fans.
Thomas: We often say that we designed our ships with families in mind. The truth of the matter is, I will take it a step further and say they are the perfect platform for a multi-generational family vacation. What do I mean by that? What I mean by that is that the combination of Disney, the convenience of a cruise, the destinations - including private islands and other spectacular destinations - is a great winning formula. You can come with a large family, and everyone will enjoy their vacation, because none of them needs to compromise. We have the adult areas here. We have the adult restaurants. And then occasionally we want to mix here.
And then, of course, we focus a lot on our crew. Walt said, you can build the best places on Earth, but it takes people to make a dream reality. That's a fact of life. And that's why I think a Disney cruise is so unique. It has that Disney element to it, and it is complemented by the convenience, by the destinations, by the crew, and of course, our innovation that we introduce.
People say, 'oh, you have a cruise line,' and I often say, no, we're actually not in the cruise business. We are the business of creating memories, and we are the Walt Disney Company. We're a media company. We just happen to have a platform that's called cruise and that's exactly how we bring that platform to life.
Robert: Finally, how does Disney Treasure and this new class of ships that started with Disney Wish extend your ability to meet all of your goals and go beyond what Disney could do with its other ships in the past?
Thomas: The Treasure is going to take over our seven-day cruises to the Eastern and Western Caribbean. So the ship that used to do the seven-day cruises is now going to do a series of four- and five-day cruises, not just out of Port Canaveral, but from more destinations. So what it allows you is more flexibility.
As for the Treasure itself, it allows us to introduce new stories. Treasure is the first trip where we bring the stories of some of our most beloved theme park experiences to life. I'm very excited about this. I can tell you when you see the Haunted Mansion Parlor, when you see the Skipper Society, when you see the tribute to Epcot, it's pretty phenomenal.
The one thing I always hear from our guests is, 'oh, when I go on your cruise, I know it's a bit more, it's a premium brand, but I love the value.' It's worth it. And we do this in two ways. One is we make sure we have a variety of different room categories to make sure that every budget can be , met. The second one is more variety of cruise length, so whether you want a three-day cruise, a four-day cruise, a five-day cruise, a seven-day cruise, or longer than seven days, it all plays together.
When we started the cruise line, 26 years ago, honestly speaking, families didn't go cruising. It really was Disney that raised the awareness for cruising for families. I think despite our smaller sizes of past, we've established ourselves clearly as a leader in family cruising. I think what Treasure and all her sisters will do is just simply further strengthen what I would call our undisputed position as the leader in multi-generational cruising.
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Whenever I drive to San Diego on I-5, there's a wall at Camp Pendleton that has a Navy slogan, "No Beach Out Of Reach." I think that might soon be the DCL slogan after this expansion.
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I wish Disney had ships departing from Norfolk, Virginia. I don't like having to travel to Florida to get on a cruise.